Difficulty During Nap Time

[happymom]

Happymom, what is his bedtime? What is his wake time?

8pm bedtime (but he takes 1-2 hours to fall asleep), wakes at 7:40am ( I wake him up, he would sleep much later if I didn't have to wake him)

[hwichlaz]

Then the simple option is to not have him where he can reach his friends....really rolling my eyes at his providers.

[Rockgirl]

It's a little sad to me that he gets a consequence for not falling asleep. That is something that is probably out of his control. It sounds like he's laying there with his eyes closed for a long time, especially for a kid his age. If they're not providing a quiet activity, he's probably doing the best he can. I was in a home dc at that age, and rarely fell asleep, but rested during nap. I think a consequence for not actually falling asleep is a bit harsh. But of course, that's just my opinion.

[happymom]

I'm not sure why they give him multiple chances before they move him away from other kids.

I talked to the lead who was at the front desk about options for him if he doesn't fall asleep. It sounds like I just need to make a plan with his teacher as to how to handle it.

I try to treat it more as a reward for napping than a consequence for not napping, but it definitely goes both ways. Leap frog when he naps, and he is reminded he didn't earn his leap frog if he does not nap. My husband and I don't see 100% eye to eye because he thinks our son has control over whether he naps and choose not to nap/doesn't try hard enough...where I feel like if he's quiet and not waking his friends and he takes a rest; that's good enough for me.

[Alwaysgreener]

I'm not sure why they give him multiple chances before they move him away from other kids.

I talked to the lead who was at the front desk about options for him if he doesn't fall asleep. It sounds like I just need to make a plan with his teacher as to how to handle it.

I try to treat it more as a reward for napping than a consequence for not napping, but it definitely goes both ways. Leap frog when he naps, and he is reminded he didn't earn his leap frog if he does not nap. My husband and I don't see 100% eye to eye because he thinks our son has control over whether he naps and choose not to nap/doesn't try hard enough...where I feel like if he's quiet and not waking his friends and he takes a rest; that's good enough for me.

IMO He should get rewarded with the leap frog for laying quietly and resting, whether or not he sleeps should not be an issue. My dd gets rewarded for staying in bed at night, no matter how long it takes her to fall asleep.

Check out http://www.babysleepsite.com/

and

https://www.amazon.com/Sleepless-America-Child-Misbehaving-Missing/dp/006073602X

[Leigh]

8pm bedtime (but he takes 1-2 hours to fall asleep), wakes at 7:40am ( I wake him up, he would sleep much later if I didn't have to wake him)

Well, at that age, they need 10-13 hours of sleep. They usually try to get it all at night at 4.5. Thing is, they still NEED the naps in the daytime, but that can turn into a very late bedtime (as you already know).

The way I see it, you have two choices: adjust at home or adjust at childcare (find him a new one). I recently stopped requiring naps for the over 4 crowd, provided that they are quiet at naptime. Anyone gets loud, and they go to nap, too. It's been working. I set up something for them to do at the kitchen table (crafts, painting, play doh) or put on a movie for them at naptime if they can't go outside during nap (rain).

If you want to try something at home first, you might try bedtime an hour later AND wake time an hour earlier and see if that helps him take a nap at daycare. If he's taking 1-2 hours to fall asleep, he's not tired enough at bedtime. Napping at daycare could make this worse. You could give it a month long try and see if it helps. You've probably already tried it, but no screens for 90-120 minutes before bed can help, a warm bath, and reading some books or playing quiet games in the evening could help, too. Exercise after daycare could help (a hike, a trip to the park, swimming, a game of tag, etc.).

That's all I have for "advice". It's a tough situation for the parent and the provider-you both need him to sleep on YOUR terms, but find that he'll sleep on his own!

[happymom]

Thank you for the advice, I will start waking him up earlier. It would be good for him (and me) to have more time at home in the morning anyway. He's always SO TIRED in the morning and grumpy.

If it helps him continue with naps through the year, great! If not, I can make a plan with his teacher as to what to do for him when he's not asleep by a certain time.

He's been sleep deprived in the past, so perhaps I'm trying to overcompensate at this point and maybe he just doesn't need as much sleep as I think he needs and it's not a big deal.

His teacher details his nap time now on his daily report "no nap but he was quiet", so I am trying to enforce with my husband that if we can count on him to have that rest and he's not disturbing others, we should show him that we're proud of him.

[happymom]

Thank you to everyone who helped me work through this, by the way.

I appreciate it so much. I feel so much better about the days that he doesn't sleep. I'm going to do a better job in making sure that there is a policy in place for him where if he is not asleep in 60 minutes, he will be given a quiet activity to do AND NOT be forced to continue to try to fall asleep.

[Unregistered]

I wonder if 8pm bedtime is too late if he is not napping during the day. He may be getting his second wind and be overtired which could be why he is awake for an hour or two when he goes to bed.
This is a good site for ideas of bed times.

http://www.sleepsisters.com/bedtimes-by-age/

Ages 3 - 6 says between 6pm to 8pm. Being four, maybe 6.30 - 7.00 might be something you could try.

[happymom]

I wonder if 8pm bedtime is too late if he is not napping during the day. He may be getting his second wind and be overtired which could be why he is awake for an hour or two when he goes to bed.
This is a good site for ideas of bed times.

http://www.sleepsisters.com/bedtimes-by-age/

Ages 3 - 6 says between 6pm to 8pm. Being four, maybe 6.30 - 7.00 might be something you could try.

Those suggestions do not take into account at all what time the child is waking? Who are these people who wrote this website? My child sleeps 11-12 hours each night, plus 1-2 days a week he naps.

8pm is honestly difficult enough. I pick up the kids at 5:30, unpack, nurse the baby, make dinner, eat dinner, leave kitchen a mess around 7: get both kids in pajamas, nurse baby to sleep (while dad winds down/reads with my oldest). Since the kids share a room, my older doesn't lay down until baby is asleep.

Not trying to be rude, but honestly, these recommendations seem like a one-size-fits-all type solution and not realistic for a set of parents who both work. We already have a limited amount of time with them.

[Alwaysgreener]

Those suggestions do not take into account at all what time the child is waking? Who are these people who wrote this website? My child sleeps 11-12 hours each night, plus 1-2 days a week he naps.

8pm is honestly difficult enough. I pick up the kids at 5:30, unpack, nurse the baby, make dinner, eat dinner, leave kitchen a mess around 7: get both kids in pajamas, nurse baby to sleep (while dad winds down/reads with my oldest). Since the kids share a room, my older doesn't lay down until baby is asleep.

Not trying to be rude, but honestly, these recommendations seem like a one-size-fits-all type solution and not realistic for a set of parents who both work. We already have a limited amount of time with them.

Yes I disagree with that advice too. Cookie cutter bedtime is not what you need. Bedtime need to be based on wake up time.
He shares a room but is not falling asleep right away. Could there be something that bothers him? (shadow or noise) What would happen, if for a weekend you slept the baby in your room and let him sleep alone, would he fall asleep faster?
Have you every used lavender, sound machine or prayer to help him to relax?
If he is not falling asleep easily, then he may not be getting a restful night. Personally I am against waking him but I understand you must, but I would not wake him any earlier than you have to, when you do wake him, how do you do it? Slowly, or all at once? I would do it slowly, with lights and noise, let his body do the waking not you, it should improve his morning mood making for a better morning.

Children naturally wake at the same time, so if a child needs more sleep, it is recommend to adjust his bedtime not wake time.

[mommyneedsadayoff]

8pm bedtime (but he takes 1-2 hours to fall asleep), wakes at 7:40am ( I wake him up, he would sleep much later if I didn't have to wake him)

Thank you for the advice, I will start waking him up earlier. It would be good for him (and me) to have more time at home in the morning anyway. He's always SO TIRED in the morning and grumpy.

If it helps him continue with naps through the year, great! If not, I can make a plan with his teacher as to what to do for him when he's not asleep by a certain time.

He's been sleep deprived in the past, so perhaps I'm trying to overcompensate at this point and maybe he just doesn't need as much sleep as I think he needs and it's not a big deal.

His teacher details his nap time now on his daily report "no nap but he was quiet", so I am trying to enforce with my husband that if we can count on him to have that rest and he's not disturbing others, we should show him that we're proud of him.

Those suggestions do not take into account at all what time the child is waking? Who are these people who wrote this website? My child sleeps 11-12 hours each night, plus 1-2 days a week he naps.

8pm is honestly difficult enough. I pick up the kids at 5:30, unpack, nurse the baby, make dinner, eat dinner, leave kitchen a mess around 7: get both kids in pajamas, nurse baby to sleep (while dad winds down/reads with my oldest). Since the kids share a room, my older doesn't lay down until baby is asleep.

Not trying to be rude, but honestly, these recommendations seem like a one-size-fits-all type solution and not realistic for a set of parents who both work. We already have a limited amount of time with them.

I am a little confused. You said you put him down at 8 now and it takes 1-2 hours to fall asleep. So he gets less that ten hours at night on average, especially when he doesn't nap. If you want to start waking him even earlier (which I don't think is a bad idea), then he should probably go down earlier. It sounds like there is just too much going on that is not really working with his natural schedule. He must wait for baby to go down and then share a room (does baby wake at night?). He must be awoken in the morning because you need to get work. He must fall asleep by 2 at naps, otherwise be woken up. He must rest quietly and try to sleep at times when he may not be tired, but when he is tired and sleeping, he gets woke up. I know it is tough, since you both work and want the time with your kiddos, but I think it may be best to get him down by 7pm and up by 7am. I know...easier said than done, but if he gets home, eats, bath, book, bed and he gets a good hour to fall asleep before baby comes to bed, he may go to sleep more quickly. Then wake him earlier and spend the morning having a great breakfast. Y the time nap rolls around at school, he may be tired enough to sleep or he may not, but at least he has a bed time that allows him 12 hours of time to get the job done, kwim? It is not one size fits all, but at his age (naps wont be an option in kindy), I would focus more on the night sleep than trying to "catch up" with nap sleep. You can guarantee he will go to bed every night, but you cannot guarantee the nap anymore, so work with the one that will benefit him most, which is great night sleep.

[happymom]

Worst case he would get just under 10 hours of sleep. But most days he is asleep by 9 and some days I am able to get him in bed a bit early and he is asleep by 8:40 *these are the best days*

More often than not he is getting closer to 11 hours at night. My baby wakes up first, so I go in their shared room and open the curtains and start getting baby ready and in some cases it wakes up my 4 year old. Sometimes, it doesn't. Then I have to actually wake him.

I'm sorry I'm not great at using quotes on forums, but baby sometimes sleeps through the night, sometimes he doesn't. Lately he has been waking frequently.

While I can guarantee my kid will sleep every night, I can not guarantee he will be asleep by 8pm. We really do our best. If it were up to following his natural schedule, he would sleep at 10-10 every day and not have a nap. Not realistic because we work and his daycare has scheduled naps. He's such a night owl.

[daycarediva]

He moves to the older group starting Monday, but nothing changes in regards to nap time.

I am going to talk to the director about accommodations, but I wanted to see, first, if I could get him back in a napping routine.

Over the long weekend I WAS able to get him to nap. I REALLY do think he should have a nap, so I want to exhaust all my options in regards to turning him in to a napper again rather than get him on a no-nap plan with the daycare.

What time did he fall asleep at home after his nap on the weekends? Can you push bedtime back and wake him earlier?

If not, and all else fails I would discuss options with the center- I stagger my kids to sleep. Youngest first, oldest last. Oldest is a 50/50 napper, but she gets books, puzzles, file folder games, or busy boxes on her mat and is quiet as a mouse either way. I also play books on CD.

If he doesn't nap, would they be open to him bringing a rest time activity? My 4yo dck is playing with empty plastic baby wipe container with a lego base glued to the underside and legos in it.

[mommyneedsadayoff]

Worst case he would get just under 10 hours of sleep. But most days he is asleep by 9 and some days I am able to get him in bed a bit early and he is asleep by 8:40 *these are the best days*

More often than not he is getting closer to 11 hours at night. My baby wakes up first, so I go in their shared room and open the curtains and start getting baby ready and in some cases it wakes up my 4 year old. Sometimes, it doesn't. Then I have to actually wake him.

I'm sorry I'm not great at using quotes on forums, but baby sometimes sleeps through the night, sometimes he doesn't. Lately he has been waking frequently.

While I can guarantee my kid will sleep every night, I can not guarantee he will be asleep by 8pm. We really do our best. If it were up to following his natural schedule, he would sleep at 10-10 every day and not have a nap. Not realistic because we work and his daycare has scheduled naps. He's such a night owl.

Honestly, it sounds like you are doing everything you can, so I would try not to sweat it too much. He is laying quietly at nap and may need it some days (maybe on the days the baby was up frequently at night or whatnot), but some days, he may just need the quiet and then hopefully he would be able to get up and do quiet activities. I would aim for the 10-12 hours at night, which it sounds like he is getting, so naps would really be a day by day basis. The main point is that they give him the option to rest/sleep and his body will decide the rest. On days he does not fall asleep, I hope they give him other options to do quietly till nap is over.