What Do You Do With A Child Who Won't Stay In A Child's Place?

[Hunni Bee]

I know that sounds antiquated and it is, but I could think of no other way to word it.

I have a 4 year old who will be 5 in Dec. She is the oldest kid I have, and 6 months older than the next oldest, 8 months older than the next oldest girl. She's a pretty well-behaved child and very intelligent but...

...she will NOT go mind her business, which is playing with her friends.

She is constantly in my or my assistant's face, telling on someone, telling US how we should handle other children, telling us what we should do next, asking for things. She is constantly telling other children what to do. I instituted a "tattle = immediate time-out" policy with her, and that has cut down on the constant tattling, but she just seems not to be able to go handle children's business.

If I give her an instruction, I have to give it over and over...because after each one she's telling me how she would rather do it or "why don't you make ____ do it".

She's the one who, at breakfast, told one of the morning teachers "um, you need to go get his breakfast now." when another child came in.

I know we're living a brave new world and everything, but I still believe in children behaving like children and speaking respectfully to adults...

...what do you ladies think/do?

[Heidi]

I know that sounds antiquated and it is, but I could think of no other way to word it.

I have a 4 year old who will be 5 in Dec. She is the oldest kid I have, and 6 months older than the next oldest, 8 months older than the next oldest girl. She's a pretty well-behaved child and very intelligent but...

...she will NOT go mind her business, which is playing with her friends.

She is constantly in my or my assistant's face, telling on someone, telling US how we should handle other children, telling us what we should do next, asking for things. She is constantly telling other children what to do. I instituted a "tattle = immediate time-out" policy with her, and that has cut down on the constant tattling, but she just seems not to be able to go handle children's business.

If I give her an instruction, I have to give it over and over...because after each one she's telling me how she would rather do it or "why don't you make ____ do it".

She's the one who, at breakfast, told one of the morning teachers "um, you need to go get his breakfast now." when another child came in.

I know we're living a brave new world and everything, but I still believe in children behaving like children and speaking respectfully to adults...

...what do you ladies think/do?

I agree with you 100%. I don't mind giving children a reason for something...if I want to give them a reason. Sometimes, I simply answer "because I am the adult here, and I said so", or "why do YOU think?".

As for tattling..my first question would be "are you telling me this to get someone IN trouble, or telling me to get someone "OUT of trouble? In trouble =time out, out of trouble...thank you.

Have you sat her down and talked to her about it when it's NOT happening? Something like "when you say these things, I think you are trying to be helpful, but you actually sound a little rude. Here, the grown-ups are in charge, and the kids just get to have fun and play. That is the kids' job! How about if when I do this (make up a signal), then you know that what you are doing is rude. THat way, you will know BEFORE you get in trouble, and can just go have fun instead of sitting in boring old time out?"

Worth a try....

[WImom]

I have three girls this way - they feed off each other. I've started just daying 'because it's the rule' unless it's something that really needs an answer. That seems to have cut it down alot.

I've also started telling my main tattler, in mid sentence of a tattle, that if she's tattling I'm going to walk away. Then she either stops or I walk away.

[laundrymom]

I would just tell her, " Susan, you are a little girl, your job is to play. I'm the grown up, I make grown up choices. Go play now. "

[SilverSabre25]

I have this with my DD, who is in the same boat--older by a good bit than everyone else. I tell her, "You only worry about [DD] not anyone else."

Ugh I feel you though...it's frustrating and a bit annoying. DD has taught this tendency to the next oldest dcb, who is doing it too. One of my youngest dcks is very...bossy, and does this too. Rawr.

[MsMe]

I have a boy like this. He is a SA so I only have three days afterschool and it has gotten better. I used the ' you are kid it is your job to play, and mine to make sure they follow the rules.'

[nannyde]

Everything she is doing is to get YOU to "do" her.

She is engaging you so she wins. Even if you tell her it doesn't have anything to do with her and to go play she gets the TIME and ATTENTION that saying "it doesn't have anything to do with you.. go play". THAT'S what she's after. Your response to her is what she wants. Doesn't matter WHAT she brings to you.. she gets what she wants. Doesn't matter if she is telling the other kids what to do .. she knows that leads to YOU doing HER.

You need to get her prompts down to "go play toys" "play toys" ... "you TOYS" ... "toys".. "go".

She needs super sharp prompts that are at MOST three words but at best one word. The rest of her prompts need to be with your body language, tone, and facial expressions.

When she is approaching you with her "engagement" behavior start off with "go play toys" ..... if she comes at you again or after one of the other kids then give her "YOU go play". If she reoffends again then get it shorter 'YOU toys".. then just to TOYS!!!!!

Your nonverbal needs to be a strict stern look.. eyes squinted.. lips tight.. and stare directly at her. Tone needs to be low and the words need to come out quick.

If she doesn't back down then you put your hand on her shoulders and redirect her to the toy area and then say the words "go play toys".

So when she comes to tattle on one of the kids.......... stand up....... look down.... game face on....... and say "go play toys".

You don't have to negotiate with her. You don't have to explain things to her. You don't have to listen to her opinion. You don't have to allow her to give you a news report update on the kids. You don't have to have her EVER between you, your staff assistant, or the other kids.

She doesn't deserve to be treated like an adult. It hurts her to have that role. It hurts her ability to enjoy this precious time as a child. Give her the gift of the role of a child in your group.

That means stopping full stop her tip toeing or barging into your business.

Every minute of every day she needs an adult to confirm with her that she is to DO toys and DO being a friend to the kids and DO being a child. That's what shes CRAVING for. The rules, boundaries, and limitations that keep her in the child role.

You are punishing her by these actions......... you are BLESSING her when you do it. You are respecting her right to be a child in the GROUP of children.


Give THAT to her. She deserves it and needs it.

The way to check on how you guys are responding to her that makes her THINK she's one of you instead of a kid that needs to go play is how many seconds it takes to get her to comply and how many words you are using to get her to do it. It needs to get down to one word to her and one second she gets back on track. Then the number of "engagement" behaviors she gives you needs to dramatically decline within a week.

That is when you will know she is getting it. She will show you a calm and centered kid when you put her back into the life of a child in the group in your group of kids.

[Hunni Bee]

Everything she is doing is to get YOU to "do" her.

She is engaging you so she wins. Even if you tell her it doesn't have anything to do with her and to go play she gets the TIME and ATTENTION that saying "it doesn't have anything to do with you.. go play". THAT'S what she's after. Your response to her is what she wants. Doesn't matter WHAT she brings to you.. she gets what she wants. Doesn't matter if she is telling the other kids what to do .. she knows that leads to YOU doing HER.

You need to get her prompts down to "go play toys" "play toys" ... "you TOYS" ... "toys".. "go".

She needs super sharp prompts that are at MOST three words but at best one word. The rest of her prompts need to be with your body language, tone, and facial expressions.

When she is approaching you with her "engagement" behavior start off with "go play toys" ..... if she comes at you again or after one of the other kids then give her "YOU go play". If she reoffends again then get it shorter 'YOU toys".. then just to TOYS!!!!!

Your nonverbal needs to be a strict stern look.. eyes squinted.. lips tight.. and stare directly at her. Tone needs to be low and the words need to come out quick.

If she doesn't back down then you put your hand on her shoulders and redirect her to the toy area and then say the words "go play toys".

So when she comes to tattle on one of the kids.......... stand up....... look down.... game face on....... and say "go play toys".

You don't have to negotiate with her. You don't have to explain things to her. You don't have to listen to her opinion. You don't have to allow her to give you a news report update on the kids. You don't have to have her EVER between you, your staff assistant, or the other kids.

She doesn't deserve to be treated like an adult. It hurts her to have that role. It hurts her ability to enjoy this precious time as a child. Give her the gift of the role of a child in your group.

That means stopping full stop her tip toeing or barging into your business.

Every minute of every day she needs an adult to confirm with her that she is to DO toys and DO being a friend to the kids and DO being a child. That's what shes CRAVING for. The rules, boundaries, and limitations that keep her in the child role.

You are punishing her by these actions......... you are BLESSING her when you do it. You are respecting her right to be a child in the GROUP of children.


Give THAT to her. She deserves it and needs it.

The way to check on how you guys are responding to her that makes her THINK she's one of you instead of a kid that needs to go play is how many seconds it takes to get her to comply and how many words you are using to get her to do it. It needs to get down to one word to her and one second she gets back on track. Then the number of "engagement" behaviors she gives you needs to dramatically decline within a week.

That is when you will know she is getting it. She will show you a calm and centered kid when you put her back into the life of a child in the group in your group of kids.

This.

Thank you. Seriously.

This is what I want to do, but I wasn't sure how to go about it. I'm weary of explaining "its not your business - go play" to her, and its not doing any good anyway. Like you said, it still amounts to me "doing" her and her doing me instead of her toys and friends.

[Unregistered]

So -your message to the child consists of 6 words and it doesn't work, but Nannyde's 3 word message is a miracle cure? Sounds to me like you were saying the exact same thing to the child as Nannyde is recommending. I am confused as to how her solution is any different than what you've been doing already. I'm not trying to do a "troll" thing here but am just curious as to what makes her words any different from your words since they all seem to me to be/mean the exact same thing. I have a child just like this and I tell him the same sort of thing and yet he persists, so I'd really like to know the exact number of words that will magically make him stop!

[Michael]

So -your message to the child consists of 6 words and it doesn't work, but Nannyde's 3 word message is a miracle cure? Sounds to me like you were saying the exact same thing to the child as Nannyde is recommending. I am confused as to how her solution is any different than what you've been doing already. I'm not trying to do a "troll" thing here but am just curious as to what makes her words any different from your words since they all seem to me to be/mean the exact same thing. I have a child just like this and I tell him the same sort of thing and yet he persists, so I'd really like to know the exact number of words that will magically make him stop!

Try the smileys. They will make you seem less trollish.

[Blackcat31]

So -your message to the child consists of 6 words and it doesn't work, but Nannyde's 3 word message is a miracle cure? Sounds to me like you were saying the exact same thing to the child as Nannyde is recommending. I am confused as to how her solution is any different than what you've been doing already. I'm not trying to do a "troll" thing here but am just curious as to what makes her words any different from your words since they all seem to me to be/mean the exact same thing. I have a child just like this and I tell him the same sort of thing and yet he persists, so I'd really like to know the exact number of words that will magically make him stop!

Because one way is words only with zero support in any other area.

The other response involves a process of teaching the child her "place" so to speak. It involves words, tone of voice, body language, action and a continuous routine which reassures the child that this is the way it is and within that concept is security.

A secure child will feel comfortable enough to simply be who they are and do their job (playing) and not have to feel as though they need to have negative behaviors and actions just to get attention.

Using only words would be severely falling short of the "big picture" and successfully getting the child to stop the negative behaviors.

[Hunni Bee]

So -your message to the child consists of 6 words and it doesn't work, but Nannyde's 3 word message is a miracle cure? Sounds to me like you were saying the exact same thing to the child as Nannyde is recommending. I am confused as to how her solution is any different than what you've been doing already. I'm not trying to do a "troll" thing here but am just curious as to what makes her words any different from your words since they all seem to me to be/mean the exact same thing. I have a child just like this and I tell him the same sort of thing and yet he persists, so I'd really like to know the exact number of words that will magically make him stop!

I've always thought too much talking to little kids (as far as instructions or redirection) is the same as saying "djnmnmnseie". They shut down after a few sentences, or even a few words. So to me, there kinda is a magic way to say something that will make sense to them, shut down protests, and get them to do what you ask...in as few words possible.

[nannyde]

So -your message to the child consists of 6 words and it doesn't work, but Nannyde's 3 word message is a miracle cure? Sounds to me like you were saying the exact same thing to the child as Nannyde is recommending. I am confused as to how her solution is any different than what you've been doing already. I'm not trying to do a "troll" thing here but am just curious as to what makes her words any different from your words since they all seem to me to be/mean the exact same thing. I have a child just like this and I tell him the same sort of thing and yet he persists, so I'd really like to know the exact number of words that will magically make him stop!

Because the chaos you create around the no is the chaos that she is seeking. Decreasing the chaos means decreasing the TIME, words, and keeping your body language clear and directional.

Stand above her ...tell her "go play toys" with firm facial expressions and directional gestures (point towards toys and kids) and then turn YOUR body away so she sees only your back walking away.

If she's doing it to a group of kids at a toy do the same as above but do the directional gestures to ANOTHER area of toys and insist she go play toys there. She doesn't get chaos from you or get to create chaos with the kids. She needs to go to another area and go play toys... or go to another toy area and play toys to start over.

She must be successful everywhere she goes even if we have to orchestrate that based on her "engagement" behaviors.

It works. They get the idea that they need to make it with the kids... entertain themselves... and they can't suck the life out of the adult minute to minute. Once they get THAT then they are balanced and see the JOY in playing with their peeps with nice toys in a nice comfortable room.

[nannyde]

So -your message to the child consists of 6 words and it doesn't work, but Nannyde's 3 word message is a miracle cure?

Three words is the MAXIMUM response.

Go

Play

Toys


Then:
Play
Toys

Then

Toys

Starts out with a friendly reminder... then gets strict... then serious disaproval and demanding by the time you get to one word prompts.

It gets less and the nonverbal gets more strict and concise.

[morgan24]

So -your message to the child consists of 6 words and it doesn't work, but Nannyde's 3 word message is a miracle cure? Sounds to me like you were saying the exact same thing to the child as Nannyde is recommending. I am confused as to how her solution is any different than what you've been doing already. I'm not trying to do a "troll" thing here but am just curious as to what makes her words any different from your words since they all seem to me to be/mean the exact same thing. I have a child just like this and I tell him the same sort of thing and yet he persists, so I'd really like to know the exact number of words that will magically make him stop!

I used Nan's way on a very stubborn 4 year old dcg and it work just like she said it would.