New Reg: Let's Discuss

[Annalee]

:::::: Reg change season is always super fun.

I am curious how other states compare and contrast, though. How other people are making some of this this work.

I put so much time, money and effort into making the playroom into a self contained, childproofed, classroom like they wanted and now they seem to be trying to force me back out of it and into the kitchen/bathroom with kids in tow. A complete 180.

I am closed next Friday for the sole purpose of de-QRIS-assessing my room....20 years of number counts on math, science, literacy, music, etc is like being in a Manson-camp. I need to de-program. I call it the FCCERS-R Daycare Bible. But those days are over! Let's get back to some FUN for educators and kids! happyface

[e.j.]

At least one Staff person with a satisfactory Comprehensive Records Check Determination shall supervise Children at all times appropriate to the individual age, needs and capabilities of each child.

This policy, as typed, makes sense to me.
In my state, it's not just staff that has to have background checks. All family members over 13 years of age who live in the house have to undergo a background check and fingerprinting each time I relicense, whether they have contact with the kids or not. My husband and adult kids work during the hours my day care is operating. They pretty much have zero contact with the dc kids. I'm paying an extra $105 (plus my own $35) this year to have them all fingerprinted. On the very rare day they aren't at work while I'm watching kids, they're either sick and in bed upstairs or have an appointment of some kind and are out of the house. The last thing any of them want to do is spend time with my dc kids.

Such supervision must include, but not be limited to, indoor and outdoor activities, mealtimes, naptime, transportation, field trips, and transitions between activities.

"Supervision" means Staff members are providing watchful oversight to the children, volunteers and Students-in-Training.

The person(s) supervising in the child care area must be alert, positioned to maximize their ability to hear and see the children at all times, and able to respond promptly to the needs and actions of the children being supervised, as well as the actions of the volunteers and Students-in-Training, and provide timely attention to the children's actions and needs.

Most of this makes sense to me, too. Sad they feel as though they have to spell it out but I'm sure they've run into situations where providers are physically present but not paying attention to the kids in their care.

The regulation in my state is that we have to be able to see OR hear the kids at all times which makes more sense to me. I'd never be able to use the bathroom without bringing the kids in with me if I had to be able to see them at all times. I understand the importance of active supervision but there are times when nature calls and being able to hear the kids seems sufficient for those couple of minutes when I can't see them.

Staff shall be attentive and participating with all children during mealtimes and shall be seated within an arm’s length away from children thirty-six (36) months of age and younger.

Crazy. I wouldn't be able to do that easily. If I'm sitting, it's usually only because I have a child who is too young to feed himself. Otherwise, I'm up and busy getting kids seconds, wiping ups spills, etc. I have a rectangular table the kids eat at. I couldn't literally be within arms reach of EVERY child sitting at the table unless one or two were sitting in the middle of it. If a child were to start choking, I'm certainly close enough to help in an instant.

Plans shall be made to obtain additional Staff help in cases of emergencies.

?? As a family child care provider, are they saying you have to have standby staff to call on in case of an emergency? Here, I can call on a neighbor or friend for help in a true emergency. Under your state guidelines, they wouldn't be able to help because "at least one staff person with a satisfactory Comprehensive Records Check Determination shall supervise Children at all times" - unless they agreed to undergo the check on the off chance you needed their help at some point. Would this regulation force you to pay someone to be "on staff" just in case you have an emergency?

[Cat Herder]

This policy, as typed, makes sense to me.
In my state, it's not just staff that has to have background checks. All family members over 13 years of age who live in the house have to undergo a background check and fingerprinting each time I relicense, whether they have contact with the kids or not. My husband and adult kids work during the hours my day care is operating. They pretty much have zero contact with the dc kids. I'm paying an extra $105 (plus my own $35) this year to have them all fingerprinted. On the very rare day they aren't at work while I'm watching kids, they're either sick and in bed upstairs or have an appointment of some kind and are out of the house. The last thing any of them want to do is spend time with my dc kids.

CH: Exactly. :::::: My adult kids and husband are all fingerprinted. My kids because they may need to be here for a power outage in their apartments in winter or a quick load of laundry in a time pinch with crowded laundro-mats. My husband is background checked and completes the mandatory training each year so he can cover my DR. Appointments. This one I fully understand.


Most of this makes sense to me, too. Sad they feel as though they have to spell it out but I'm sure they've run into situations where providers are physically present but not paying attention to the kids in their care.

The regulation in my state is that we have to be able to see OR hear the kids at all times which makes more sense to me. I'd never be able to use the bathroom without bringing the kids in with me if I had to be able to see them at all times. I understand the importance of active supervision but there are times when nature calls and being able to hear the kids seems sufficient for those couple of minutes when I can't see them.

CH: See or hear is how I currently operate and I have never had an injury (bang on wood) operating like this. I don't want them at the stove or in the bathroom with me. I don't want to take the infants with the toddlers to potty. It isn't safe. Currently I put infants in their cribs and behind gate completely out of reach of others. The others are behind a baby gate and in their own childproofed playroom. It has worked for over 20 years, why the change now??


Crazy. I wouldn't be able to do that easily. If I'm sitting, it's usually only because I have a child who is too young to feed himself. Otherwise, I'm up and busy getting kids seconds, wiping ups spills, etc. I have a rectangular table the kids eat at. I couldn't literally be within arms reach of EVERY child sitting at the table unless one or two were sitting in the middle of it. If a child were to start choking, I'm certainly close enough to help in an instant.

CH: I don't know how I am going to make this work at all. I currently stand at the kitchen island standing with them while toddlers are all seated at the table 2 feet from me and infants high chairs are beside me. Again, it works and I have had no issues with this setup. The food is on the island for seconds and thirds if wanted...


?? As a family child care provider, are they saying you have to have standby staff to call on in case of an emergency? Here, I can call on a neighbor or friend for help in a true emergency. Under your state guidelines, they wouldn't be able to help because "at least one staff person with a satisfactory Comprehensive Records Check Determination shall supervise Children at all times" - unless they agreed to undergo the check on the off chance you needed their help at some point. Would this regulation force you to pay someone to be "on staff" just in case you have an emergency?

I am unsure about the last part. I am covered 90% of the time if that is what they mean. I don't know how most would do it, though.

[PB&J]

Also, the lack of participation is something I will remember when others need help.

You’ve helped me so often (directly a few times, and just through reading your posts)! I def still feel like a newbie, despite 12 years in the job. Today was a rough “daycare.com-free-day”

Our in-home state regs don’t have this kind of... intimidating? formal?... language, but they are still over-reaching for our kind of care. I’ve gone toe to toe with our inspector (not that she can do anything), saying “we don’t want a PROFESSIONAL EARLY CHILDHOOD EDUCATION kind of place! We want to open our home to parents who need to go to work....and provide SERVICES that enrich their children’s days and give them a safe, healthy place to be all day.” Yes, health and safety standards are needed. Our license should stand for something. But even our parents roll their eyes and don’t understand why the regs want our home to be exactly like the 120 (or 300!) kid center off the highway. They’ve said the licensing people are taking away THEIR choice of how they want their kids to experience baby/toddler/PS life! But the state says, once we start taking money for services, they have to be state-mandated services only. We can’t even terminate a bad fit, until we follow through on eight steps to rectify (including US setting up services and therapies for THEIR kids, and allowing evaluators into our daycare to watch the child and us interact).

I’m only the manager and not the owner. I don’t know how many more regs will pile on before I jump ship. If this were happening in my home, I would have bailed a few years ago.

[e.j.]

Would it help if enough providers in your state gave feedback to your state's EEC commissioner? EEC here came up with new regs in response to the COVID threat but some of the regs weren't realistic for most providers. After receiving enough feedback, EEC did change some of them. Maybe if enough providers give feedback to the head of EEC in your state and let him/her know how the changes would impact them and the kids, the regs might be reconsidered???
The chances are probably slim to none but it could happen.

[Annalee]

Would it help if enough providers in your state gave feedback to your state's EEC commissioner? EEC here came up with new regs in response to the COVID threat but some of the regs weren't realistic for most providers. After receiving enough feedback, EEC did change some of them. Maybe if enough providers give feedback to the head of EEC in your state and let him/her know how the changes would impact them and the kids, the regs might be reconsidered???
The chances are probably slim to none but it could happen.

This is not an easy task. I have met with licensing all the way to the top, legislators many times, had round table discussions with powers that be, etc. each time feeling "heard" only for things to remain the same or the administration change every time something began moving forward that would lessen the stringent regs. I have been in child care 34 years; FCC for 28; and have rolled with many changes....The past 20 have beat down and trod on top of FCC providers with QRIS. That is changing FINALLY, but I'm afraid it is too little too late for the FCC dying profession. While I'm happy about the changes, I'm near too old to get going again My mind has many ideas but the body don't necessarily move as fast::

[Cat Herder]

Thanks guys. I would love to be able to bail but after a certain number of years I am closer to retirement than I am able to begin another career. I have about 20 years of working left to fund my own retirement.

As far as commenting, they only listen to centers. Specifically centers who take subsidy allowing the writers to sponge federal funds to cover their self-created jobs. Most have never spent a whole week doing hands on care of children, including their own.

I do plan to write my representatives all the way from local to the top but feel it will be akin to urinating up a flag pole.

It is the federal dollars they want. Children, families and providers be damned. Universal daycare, bought voters. They want us gone.

These regs have nothing to do with coronavirus. They are using the virus to push them through while everyone is looking the other way.

[Annalee]

Thanks guys. I would love to be able to bail but after a certain number of years I am closer to retirement than I am able to begin another career. I have about 20 years of working left to fund my own retirement.

As far as commenting, they only listen to centers. Specifically centers who take subsidy allowing the writers to sponge federal funds to cover their self-created jobs. Most have never spent a whole week doing hands on care of children, including their own.

I do plan to write my representatives all the way from local to the top but feel it will be akin to urinating up a flag pole.

It is the federal dollars they want. Children, families and providers be damned. Universal daycare, bought voters. They want us gone.

These regs have nothing to do with coronavirus. They are using the virus to push them through while everyone is looking the other way.

I think covid booted our QRIS out quicker than originally intended.....no one can make visits and daycare (center and family) licenses are so far behind. All is being done virtually now and quickly. But like I stated in the earlier post, FCC is near gone anyway so all that is left is us, the ones who are too old to change careers at this point.

[Cat Herder]

I think covid booted our QRIS out quicker than originally intended.....no one can make visits and daycare (center and family) licenses are so far behind. All is being done virtually now and quickly. But like I stated in the earlier post, FCC is near gone anyway so all that is left is us, the ones who are too old to change careers at this point.

If you can't beat them, get creative. I have been working on solutions all weekend. Maybe I can make it work by A) cooking the night before and adding a half wall toilet to the playroom or B) tweaking my program into exempt status.

[Annalee]

If you can't beat them, get creative. I have been working on solutions all weekend. Maybe I can make it work by A) cooking the night before and adding a half wall toilet to the playroom or B) tweaking my program into exempt status.

I like the latter solution. I work with my mom and she slowly would like to work into only being a sub which would be possible by summer/fall 2021 as we will lose many to school then. That would lower my ratio but not be where I could be exempt but it would be nice to be exempt when my own sons had kids. Just a dream but it could happen!!! I don't know, I will probably be doing daycare FOREVER::

[PB&J]

At least one Staff person with a satisfactory Comprehensive Records Check Determination shall supervise Children at all times appropriate to the individual age, needs and capabilities of each child.

Our state doesn’t have the term “Comprehensive Records Check Determination” (criminal background check?) but the context of that sentence makes me wonder: can the rest of your staff have UNsatisfactory CRCD and care for the kids as assistants?

When we were told that we could no longer terminate a child on OUR terms and had to provide the parent with resources and services (as well as that whole rule on being required to accept unvaccinated kids), I told the inspector that these rules were going to make some of us close up. She basically replied that so far it hasn’t really been the case. (Put up or shut up I guess is what she was saying!)

I’ve had parents ask why a certain kid is still around (not that directly) and/or getting all the focus from the caregivers and all I can say is that we’re in the middle of our eight steps. PARENTS don’t like that we have to keep those kids around their kids, as well as refocus our days around them. As much as we providers need to speak up, I wish the parents would too. They say they select home-based for a reason but soon there will be no difference.

I know our regs are often written to deal with the actions of the worst caregivers and I was trying to think what prompted your state to tell you how to HAVE LUNCH with your own DCKs but I guess your theory of legislators wanting to drive us under continues to make the most “sense.”

[Annalee]

From the outside looking in, I do understand the "WHY" the state has began to deal with so much "wording terminology".

Afterall, I have a sign up that says "hold your child's hand as you walk to/from your vehicle".

We live in a generation that simply doesn't "think" or "do" the right thing much of the time.

So this "wording terminology" is likely because some providers/educators do not "do" or "think" at all so the state is protecting themselves' liability.

I.E....personal TRUE examples; like telling families at church not to let their kids run around in the parking lot after church and to always have an adult present; or asking someone to bring corn to a family-gathering and they bring green beans; or asking a family to bring rice krispie treats to a daycare party and they bring in a box of rice krispies thinking we are having cereal I guess; or telling clients not to be late picking up so they just bring in money forty minutes late like that will "fix" things;

This day and time brings many challenges for every person/organization/family/team.....times are so different from when I was a kid and my parents said the same thing about the difference from their childhood, so we have come to "this".... ???

[PB&J]

From the outside looking in, I do understand the "WHY" the state has began to deal with so much "wording terminology".

Afterall, I have a sign up that says "hold your child's hand as you walk to/from your vehicle".

We live in a generation that simply doesn't "think" or "do" the right thing much of the time.

So this "wording terminology" is likely because some providers/educators do not "do" or "think" at all so the state is protecting themselves' liability.

I.E....personal TRUE examples; like telling families at church not to let their kids run around in the parking lot after church and to always have an adult present; or asking someone to bring corn to a family-gathering and they bring green beans; or asking a family to bring rice krispie treats to a daycare party and they bring in a box of rice krispies thinking we are having cereal I guess; or telling clients not to be late picking up so they just bring in money forty minutes late like that will "fix" things;

This day and time brings many challenges for every person/organization/family/team.....times are so different from when I was a kid and my parents said the same thing about the difference from their childhood, so we have come to "this".... ???

Oh my gosh, ya got me there!! I never thought so many things have to be spelled out to so many people!

I’ve been thinking about that lunch rule in particular though: wouldn’t you be able to respond more quickly if you were already on your feet and circulating??!

[Annalee]

From the outside looking in, I do understand the "WHY" the state has began to deal with so much "wording terminology".

Afterall, I have a sign up that says "hold your child's hand as you walk to/from your vehicle".

We live in a generation that simply doesn't "think" or "do" the right thing much of the time.

So this "wording terminology" is likely because some providers/educators do not "do" or "think" at all so the state is protecting themselves' liability.

I.E....personal TRUE examples; like telling families at church not to let their kids run around in the parking lot after church and to always have an adult present; or asking someone to bring corn to a family-gathering and they bring green beans; or asking a family to bring rice krispie treats to a daycare party and they bring in a box of rice krispies thinking we are having cereal I guess; or telling clients not to be late picking up so they just bring in money forty minutes late like that will "fix" things;

This day and time brings many challenges for every person/organization/family/team.....times are so different from when I was a kid and my parents said the same thing about the difference from their childhood, so we have come to "this".... ???

One more thing:: In the past, there were "gray" areas that left for "the situation issue" however now it has to say "exactly verbatim" what is or is not accepted because we live in a "negotiating" time where "if that is not what it said exactly; or I did this because, etc."..

[Cat Herder]

I don't know all the answers, I do know that they don't care how if effects us. That is perfectly clear.

Little of it benefits kids or families, either. Well, unless your family has the biting/destructive kid and you don't want to pay for your own childcare, I suppose. I refuse to play that game, though. I have already paid my dues.