Help With This Behavior

[Unregistered]

All of a sudden My best DCK is falling apart at daycare whenever its time to cleanup. Then all I get is tears and "I want my so and so". I'm now limiting her toys as she will take out every toy in the room but refuses to cleanup. She is only allowed one set of toys and must cleanup those before using any others. Problem is she ends up whining all day for whoever and never putting away that first set of toys.

I asked mom she says it's because she doesn't want her to leave the house or go to work and she doesn't want to go to daycare. The not wanting to go to daycare apparently only happens with mom. It seems mom is projecting on the child...many times she has said to me that she doesn't want to work and wants to stay at home. Apparently that's not possible since she's in daycare. From day one I've had problems with this mom being snarky and rude in texts and emails. She's threatened to find alternate care when I took a sick day due to a gallbladder attack (not like I only had the sniffles). DCD kind of apologizes for her a lot and says she's just stressed but now it's causing behavior problems with the DCK.

DCK using crying for mommy as a way to get out of doing things she doesn't want to do, dad confirmed this is the case at home. Unfortunately, mom seems to be feeding into and says she has anxiety and it's because she doesn't want to go to daycare. From experience this isn't the only time she does it. She does it to get her way and is manipulating the mom. Mom has even taken her to the doctor for her anxiety.

How do I politely help mom understand that this is manipulation to get out of doing things she doesn't feel like doing? This is not anxiety or not liking daycare (DCK is all smiles with me until she has to clean up). This is "I don't want to do what I'm told". Mom is making it into this huge thing and DCK is very smart and knows exactly what she is doing and mom is feeding right into the manipulation making it much much worse!

[taylorw1210]

Have you told her what you've written? Honestly, if she doesn't get it and DCD can see it but can't manage to get it through to DCM either, I am at a loss. I don't have the patience for parents who refuse to work together for the sake of their child. I had a mother like this who's 3 yo girl was rotten. DCD totally got where I was coming from, but DCM was a pushover and the little girl knew it. Eventually the mom ended up moving her, thank goodness otherwise I would have term'd her. The behavior was beginning to be far too disruptive.

As far as picking up the toys - it sounds like you're doing exactly what I would do in the situation. If the little girl got too upset I would probably sit her down to have "quiet time" until she calmed down, but then have her return to the toys to clean them up. Eventually she will clean them up when she realizes everything she's missing out on...

[nannyde]

I wouldn't want to try to talk the Mom out of the anxiety diagnosis.

Anxiety is like diarrhea. Two bouts and you are out. Get a plan with Mom that she can have two bouts of anxiety and then she needs to go home. Tell her you will text her when she has the first bout to give her the heads up. When the second one hits then she must be there within one half hour to pick her up.

You are a regular home day care. You are not a therapist or a child psychologist. You shouldn't be working with her in ANY way regarding this mental illness she has. It's out of your league.

It's not fair to the kid to have an exacerbation of her mental illness in child care and not be cared for by professionals. A home child care is NOT the place for her as you don't have trained staff to meet her needs. Either the Mom comes and gets her or provide an aide JUST for her to manage her through her bouts of anxiety.

It's really easy to throw out the mental illness excuse but not so easy to DO something about it. Time for mom to deal with her child's mental illness.

[Blackcat31]

All of a sudden My best DCK is falling apart at daycare whenever its time to cleanup. Then all I get is tears and "I want my so and so". I'm now limiting her toys as she will take out every toy in the room but refuses to cleanup. She is only allowed one set of toys and must cleanup those before using any others. Problem is she ends up whining all day for whoever and never putting away that first set of toys.

I asked mom she says it's because she doesn't want her to leave the house or go to work and she doesn't want to go to daycare. The not wanting to go to daycare apparently only happens with mom. It seems mom is projecting on the child...many times she has said to me that she doesn't want to work and wants to stay at home. Apparently that's not possible since she's in daycare. From day one I've had problems with this mom being snarky and rude in texts and emails. She's threatened to find alternate care when I took a sick day due to a gallbladder attack (not like I only had the sniffles). DCD kind of apologizes for her a lot and says she's just stressed but now it's causing behavior problems with the DCK.

DCK using crying for mommy as a way to get out of doing things she doesn't want to do, dad confirmed this is the case at home. Unfortunately, mom seems to be feeding into and says she has anxiety and it's because she doesn't want to go to daycare. From experience this isn't the only time she does it. She does it to get her way and is manipulating the mom. Mom has even taken her to the doctor for her anxiety.

How do I politely help mom understand that this is manipulation to get out of doing things she doesn't feel like doing? This is not anxiety or not liking daycare (DCK is all smiles with me until she has to clean up). This is "I don't want to do what I'm told". Mom is making it into this huge thing and DCK is very smart and knows exactly what she is doing and mom is feeding right into the manipulation making it much much worse!

Why would you even entertain keeping a client that is so rude and disrespectful?

Her DD's behavior/attitude isn't going to change if she is feeding off of mom.

Sounds like the child is showing the same respect to you (or lack of) that mom is.

NO amount of money is worth keeping clients that treat you like crap.

[craftymissbeth]

Could you ask dcm what she suggests you do when dcg does it? You could possibly let dcm know that when dcg becomes disruptive and refuses to do as she's asked that you will call for a pick-up. She'll probably do one of a couple of things: 1) realize that missing work because of this is a bigger problem than she thought and correct the issue (the hopeful outcome) 2) Pull and take her somewhere that will deal with her child being manipulative 3) Feed into it more, quit her job, and stay home with dcg.

I'm a big supporter of putting problems like back on the parents... when the issue is much more difficult to resolve without full support of the parents.

I'm sure someone will have a much better, brilliant idea for you, though

[Unregistered]

I wouldn't want to try to talk the Mom out of the anxiety diagnosis.

Anxiety is like diarrhea. Two bouts and you are out. Get a plan with Mom that she can have two bouts of anxiety and then she needs to go home. Tell her you will text her when she has the first bout to give her the heads up. When the second one hits then she must be there within one half hour to pick her up.

You are a regular home day care. You are not a therapist or a child psychologist. You shouldn't be working with her in ANY way regarding this mental illness she has. It's out of your league.

It's not fair to the kid to have an exacerbation of her mental illness in child care and not be cared for by professionals. A home child care is NOT the place for her as you don't have trained staff to meet her needs. Either the Mom comes and gets her or provide an aide JUST for her to manage her through her bouts of anxiety.

It's really easy to throw out the mental illness excuse but not so easy to DO something about it. Time for mom to deal with her child's mental illness.

DCK doesn't have anxiety. MOM has anxiety and guilt over working that she is projecting onto her very smart, very manipulative child who is using it against Mom to get out of doing tasks she doesn't want to do.

It's grown so much at home that now it's spilling out into daycare. This child was sooooo easy prior to mom dropping off last week and discussing these supposed issues in front of the child. DCK was listening the whole time to what mo. Was saying and then starting to act out these same things mom said.

[craftymissbeth]

DCK doesn't have anxiety. MOM has anxiety and guilt over working that she is projecting onto her very smart, very manipulative child who is using it against Mom to get out of doing tasks she doesn't want to do.

It's grown so much at home that now it's spilling out into daycare. This child was sooooo easy prior to mom dropping off last week and discussing these supposed issues in front of the child. DCK was listening the whole time to what mo. Was saying and then starting to act out these same things mom said.

I think that's what nannyde's saying... obviously dcg doesn't have anxiety, but if mom insists that she does then dcg will be treated like she does, kwim?

[Unregistered]

I'm not ready to give up on this child because other than these bouts of "anxiety", She is dream, such a sweet girl and very helpful and loving! Also, I won't term over MOm because I never see or have to deal with her.

[Blackcat31]

I'm not ready to give up on this child because other than these bouts of "anxiety", She is dream, such a sweet girl and very helpful and loving! Also, I won't term over MOm because I never see or have to deal with her.

You may not have to deal with mom all day but you see her at drop off and pick ups and the behavior of her child IS directly related to her.

Also you are apparently bothered enough by this mom or you wouldn't have even brought up or mentioned her rude or snarky comments.

If you are going to separate the child from the parent, the comments or statements you made about the parent then has nothing to do with this situation.

I hope you find a resolution that works for you. When parents and providers aren't on the same page or working together, it is NEVER easy and rarely successful.

[Cat Herder]

I'd simply stop talking to DCM about the kids *age appropriate behavior* on your time. It is giving her the ammunition she needs to make you look incompetent and make her feel validated. I'd also never ask her how they handle things on their time, it is irrelevant to how I do things in group care.

Unless you are sending her home or terminating her, there is no need for Mom to be involved in this issue, IMHO. Natural consequences work and there are already expected behavior interventions in your regs.

Here: If DCK refuses to clean up, she sits out and loses the privilege to my toys. If she whines and disrupts an activity, she sits out and loses the privilege to participate in the activity. Rinse, repeat, no exceptions.

By going to her mom, in front of DCK, then having mom tell you that you are the problem reinforces DCK's behavior in that it obviously pleases her mom. The cycle will never stop this way.....

Get rid of them or shut Mom down, these are the only solutions I see....

[nannyde]

DCK doesn't have anxiety. MOM has anxiety and guilt over working that she is projecting onto her very smart, very manipulative child who is using it against Mom to get out of doing tasks she doesn't want to do.

It's grown so much at home that now it's spilling out into daycare. This child was sooooo easy prior to mom dropping off last week and discussing these supposed issues in front of the child. DCK was listening the whole time to what mo. Was saying and then starting to act out these same things mom said.

I know that and you know that but Mom doesn't know WE know that.

I wouldn't spend a minute on trying to talk Mom out of such a great excuse to send her home so she can have the mental help she needs.

[Unregistered]

You may not have to deal with mom all day but you see her at drop off and pick ups and the behavior of her child IS directly related to her.

Also you are apparently bothered enough by this mom or you wouldn't have even brought up or mentioned her rude or snarky comments.

If you are going to separate the child from the parent, the comments or statements you made about the parent then has nothing to do with this situation.

I hope you find a resolution that works for you. When parents and providers aren't on the same page or working together, it is NEVER easy and rarely successful.

You're right it does bother me that she's so rude. It's hard to separate because mom will text me asking how DCK is. I say "good, why did she have a rough night", moms reply is "no, she didn't want to go to daycare today, but I told her, 'I know you don't like daycare but you have to go so mommy can work'." This is an actual text exchange we had one morning and there's constantly texts or emails along these lines.

It's frustrating because mom wants her not to like daycare so mom can feel better about her guilt. I don't play into it. Mom seems upset that DCK isn't as badly behaved here as at home. She warned me one day, late in the day that DCK was in a terrible mood when leaving for daycare, I replied with "oh you'd never know it, she's been happy all day!" Well that seemed to piss her off bc then the next few text exchanges mom was nasty and rude.

I just don't know what to do with the mom!

[Cat Herder]

I just don't know what to do with the mom!

Stop the passive aggressive texting wars.

Q. How is DCK? A. Busy with blocks.

Text: She was moody this morning. Return text: Sorry to hear that.

Don't feed the crazy...........

[Blackcat31]

Stop the passive aggressive texting wars.

Q. How is DCK? A. Busy with blocks.

Text: She was moody this morning. Return text: Sorry to hear that.

Don't feed the crazy...........

YES!!! this is more what I was trying to say.

Stop playing the game with her.

The mom is going to drive you batty is you continue to let her. Let her own her own issues....it sounds like she is really struggling with the mommy-guilt but that's HER choice to do and not something you should have to deal with when you are busy trying to provide the best care you can to her child.

You are caring for the child not the parent.

[Cat Herder]

it sounds like she is really struggling with the mommy-guilt

I'd lay bets it is more anger/jealousy based. I say this from a few experiences with Mothers whose friends were financially able to stay home with their kids when they were not.

They'd take the anger to the Father first almost shaming/blaming him for not earning more... like Mom could not have saved/planned better herself.

When Dear Old Dad tells her that he is not willing to work more hours or give up more parenting time Mom turns her focus on making the childcare provider look incompetent.

If the provider is incompetent all providers must be the same so now Mom must be the martyr and stay home forcing Dads hand.

I have seen this play out more than once or twice.... :::: Anyone else??? The big issue is that they are not afraid to take your reputation to fulfill their goal. Be very careful giving ammunition.