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**nikia** · 12-08-2010, 07:14 PM

Did u talk to mom about this anymore than her saying she lost 5 pounds and is eating like crazy? Is mom worried I guess is more my question. Did dcg talk about her visit at all? I feel like it should be reported but it should be by mom and lawyers. Do u know what I mean? Like it will get sticky because of custody. My friend was in a similar situation and she called on her ex which then stopped all future visits until another hearing hers was neglect and drug use by her ex so I don't know if the drug use made a difference. Sorry I'm not helping much. These situations are so hard.

**SilverSabre25** · 12-08-2010, 07:17 PM

Um...wow! That's all I can say. There are some definite red flags there, I'd say. I don't think that you can/should report it to CPS, but I *do* think that perhaps mom should talk to her lawyers (and maybe a child psychiatrist) and they should have some talks with the kids about their visit with dad. How old is the other kid?

**SilverSabre25** · 12-08-2010, 08:10 PM

You know what...I keep thinking and thinking about this, and while I still don't think that CPS is the right move, I'm worried about some of what you say about the little girl's behavior. I don't want to say anything because I could be wrong (probably am wrong) but to go from being happy, bubbly, and carefree, to being quiet and withdrawn just really sends up a red flag for me.

I would ask mom tomorrow if you guys can schedule a conference, without the kids, to sit down and have a chat--and have the conference be as soon as possible. Tell her that you're concerned about the change in the kids, the behavior (the acting out, etc), and especially the change in dcg's behavior. See what she says. She might just need someone to validate her concerns. She might be in complete denial. But something happened. Something changed that little girl...and while it could just be being hungry for six weeks or living on a crappy diet, it could be something more. Three year olds don't change that drastically in six weeks.

I really think that she needs to contact her lawyers and ask what she can do. I think that custody arrangement needs revisited...just the fact that dad didn't have the money to bring the kids back and doesn't pay child support could be enough. I would say that the kids should be checked out by a doctor, too...just in case. And perhaps a child psychiatrist.

And if mom blows off your concerns? THEN I would contact CPS and see what they say.

**Lilbutterflie** · 12-08-2010, 08:30 PM

Yeah, I told DCM I felt it was horrible that she lost that much weight. DCM just nodded her head and looked herself like she could cry so I didn't push that subject further. I will bring it up again tomorrow and ask her point blank if she thinks their father was withholding food or worse while over there.
I have also urged her to take him back to court to fight for child support (the initial papers she signed stated he did not have to). I also brought up that I was concerned b/c dcg was so quiet today and withdrawn. DCM looked concerned, again like she might cry, but didn't say anything. I didn't push it, but I will bring it up again.
Thanks for your opinions thus far, keep them coming!

**GretasLittleFriends** · 12-08-2010, 08:40 PM

Two words... Mandatory Reporter

Even if the mom seemed as though she was going to cry, I'd discuss this straight to the point with her. I certainly wouldn't want to have a suspicion and not do something about it, then find out later I should have listened to my gut and find out that by not doing anything that only had the child/ren subjected to worse treatment.

**Lilbutterflie** · 12-09-2010, 06:44 AM

UPDATE: First words out of dcg's mouth today were "Hi! Can we have some cereal now?" She is still hungry as ever (she's had two huge bowls of cereal thus far); but her behavior seems back to normal so far. Bubbly & energetic. EXCEPT when she was eating and the rest of the kids and I were making these funny noises with our mouths; I asked her if she wanted to try & she looked at me as stern as could be and said "I'M EATING." She was dead serious... nothing was going to keep her from eating!
I'm planning on talking to mom at pickup today, telling her point blank that I think something happened over there and that I am a mandated reporter. She said that she was going to be calling dad last night so I'll see if she confronted him about her losing 5 pounds.

**Crystal** · 12-09-2010, 06:46 AM

It couldn't hurt to contact CPS and ask them if this should be reported. They'll tell you EXACTLY what you need to do.

Good luck, i hope everything is okay with the little girl.

Please keep us posted.

**countrymom** · 12-09-2010, 06:52 AM

hmm, I think something happened when they were there. I would start asking the kids, you would be amazed what they will tell you but not their mom. Mom needs to talk to the lawyer but most important she needs to start documenting. First, I wouldn't let them leave the state knowing that dad couldn't afford to send them back, that alone would be a red flag.

**TGT09** · 12-09-2010, 06:53 AM

WOW! SOMETHING happened, DCM should be acknowledging that. Whether it be witholding food (can't afford food) or something worse. A child doesn't become withdrawn for no reason (I have sexual abuse on the brain so please excuse me). I am about to become a foster parent along with daycare, my heart says, talk with mom and if she does nothing or shows no concern then call CPS. YOU are possibly the only person that will stick up for dcg!!!!!!!!!

**TGT09** · 12-09-2010, 06:57 AM

I also understand everyone else's lack of wanting to call CPS...it can be scary to accuse someone! It could even lose you a daycare child but honestly, I feel like that's what needs to be done even after talking to mom. This child has experienced SOMETHING. There are some serious red flags here and if this were my dcg, I would have already called dcm AND cps! I agree with pp that says if he couldn't afford to fly them home (knowing how many months ago that he was going to have to) then he probably wasn't feeding them on a normal basis or not enough! This is scary and I really feel for you that you've been put in this position! Out of everything I've read on here, foster classes, etc.....this is one big serious situation! NO child should be losing 5 lbs in 6 weeks! It's also possible that if you don't call and she ends up at the Ped for something that THEY will call!

**Crystal** · 12-09-2010, 07:14 AM

While I agree that something may have happened, it is also possible that the little girl just didn't feel comfortable being with dad. If he lives far enough away that they have to fly to visit, then perhaps she doesn't know her father very well, missed Mommy very much and didn't eat.

I'd tread lightly, seeing as how she is back with Mom and not in imminent danger. Call CPS, or even your licensing worker, and get their input. They will tell you the appropriate course of action.

Continue to talk to Mom, ask her her feelings on the subject. I am sure she will be grateful that you are looking out for the best interests of her child and may even welcome the dialouque.

**QualiTcare** · 12-09-2010, 07:28 AM

i would definitely talk to the mom. it sounds like she's not thrilled about them going with their dad, but doesn't have a choice because it's ordered by the court. of course, if that's the case - it might seem like she's just trying to "get back at dad" because she's angry if she reports him. she may even WELCOME him being reported by someone else.

how old is the other child? i imagine it would be hard to investigate since the kids are no longer with him and if the 3 year old is the best source they have.

i'd urge her to take the 3 year old to the doctor asap so the weight loss can be documented.

**DBug** · 12-09-2010, 07:31 AM

I really feel for you -- I know how scary it is to know that there's a good chance something bad happened, but to not have any undeniable proof!

I would call CPS too (CAS for us Canucks

), and just ask if there's reason for concern, giving all the reasons you gave us. I would also be upfront with dc mom, and let her know I'd be calling. Like a pp said, she might need some back-up with her suspicions too.

I would be very careful though, exactly how you talk to dcg about it. Don't ask any leading yes/no questions. Open-ended questions would be fine, just make sure you don't go anywhere near planting ideas in her mind. I would hate for the dad to honestly be guilty of something and for it to be thrown out of court on a technicality because someone may have affected the dcg's testimony, kwim?

**Lilbutterflie** · 12-09-2010, 07:38 AM

Originally posted by Crystal View Post

While I agree that something may have happened, it is also possible that the little girl just didn't feel comfortable being with dad. If he lives far enough away that they have to fly to visit, then perhaps she doesn't know her father very well, missed Mommy very much and didn't eat.

I'd tread lightly, seeing as how she is back with Mom and not in imminent danger. Call CPS, or even your licensing worker, and get their input. They will tell you the appropriate course of action.

Continue to talk to Mom, ask her her feelings on the subject. I am sure she will be grateful that you are looking out for the best interests of her child and may even welcome the dialouque.

This is what my DH said when I talked to him about it. He thinks she was just "missing home and mommy", so she didn't eat. Well, it's just not like her to be this way. Her very first day with me, she was as comfortable as can be, no adjustment period whatsoever. She would go with a stranger if she was asked to, she waves and talks to anyone and everyone she comes in contact with. She also just spent a week with him in July, so there was only two and a half months of not seeing him.
I talked to both kids this morning at separate times, all alone, and both told me similar stories. They mostly would eat PB&J for breakfast. When asked about dinner, they said sometimes they did not have dinner. Just snacks. When asked if they were ever hungry with daddy, or if they got enough to eat; dcb said he always got enough to eat while dcg said "No, not with daddy. Only at Mommy's house, I get to eat a lot at Mommy's house." Well, dcb is 4 1/2, dcg is 3 1/2; so their perception of "breakfast, lunch and dinner" is not always accurate to the appropriate times of day. I don't really think I can make assumptions about what they told me. What I DO know is that there was some kind of neglect... the poor girl's rib cage is felt through her shirt when you hug her for goodness sake!
As I speak, she is role-playing with the other kids, she is playing a kitten who is hungry and eating out of a bowl. :confused:

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