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**EntropyControlSpecialist** · 03-25-2013, 07:37 PM

I haven't had children withdrawn for any odd reasons. I either force their hand in leaving (REALLY hard ... it'd be impossible for them not to leave), they leave due to moving/Kinder, or I term them.

I would have a sit down talk with DCD and DCM both present and say that you're receiving mixed signals about the quality of care you are providing from the parents. Mom seems satisfied and happy, while Dad seems unsatisfied and unhappy. I would explain how typical it is for a 2-year-old who enjoys spending the day at your daycare doesn't want to leave. Really build it up to be "completely normal" and "just a phase." It might put Dads mind at ease.

**blandino** · 03-25-2013, 07:44 PM

Originally posted by Needavacanow View Post

Hello ladies, have lurked here for years, created an account ages ago, and am finally going to post. Although I'm not an active poster, the advice on here has been invaluable, oftentimes hilarious, and I never miss a day. Thank-you to all you wonderful ladies:hug:

Sorry for the long post. Have a DCB, loves coming, mom drops off and is happy that he loves it here. Unfortunately overly sensitive dad picks up, and pick-ups have become worse over the weeks. DCB is now running from his dad and holding onto my legs not wanting to leave. Two year olds will do that, I'm sure he loves his dads hurt face, nothing more, nothing less.

Anyway dad is now taking it out on me. Started out by asking if he ate anything (love this kid, never have left overs), if he's able to have a rest here (yeah, tired kids wanna stay and play all night), is he going on the potty (constipation makes him want his caregiver?). Basically any passive aggressive remarks he can think of. And yes, I know these are normal questions from a parent, I talk about these things every day with other parents, this is just somehow different, accusatory rather than curious. Seasoned providers will know what I'm talking about.

So today dad shows up as we're just coming back from our walk, holding two other children's hands, DCB beside us stoops to put snow in his mouth as his dad is walking towards us. No big deal around here. As soon as DCB saw his dad he ran away crying, clinging, the usual BS. You know when you kind of know something's coming? Well I tried to busy myself with the other kids, getting drinks, ect but dad wouldn't leave and then finally blurted out 'Do you even watch DCB, you let him just eat off the ground'. I was kind of shocked, but (hopefully) covered it quickly and just said 'it's snow, kids eat snow, not a big deal DCD' in my best mommy voice. He kinda mumbled something under his breath and walked out, no good-bye or anything, which truthfully I'm getting used to.

The thing that bothers me the most is what does he tell his wife? I kinda suspect that it's not 'DCB runs from me screaming when I pick him up', more like 'Why the h*ll are we going to this place, DCPr is an idiot' or something to that effect.

Also, (yes another story) I was termed once when I first started about five years ago. We always came upstairs to meet the parents at pick-up. DCG went and got her empty yogurt as her mom was showing up, probably looked like we were having snack at 5, I really didn't think about it until the next day DCM gave two weeks notice because we weren't structured enough. I still want to pull my hair out just thinking about it. It was just such an untrue way to get termed. Can't argue if someone doesn't want to bring their child anymore, would be more demeaning.

This is really more of a vent I guess, but where do I go from here. I know the dad is hurt and taking it out on me in a passive aggressive way, I would like to ask them to leave so I don't dread pick-up (who of us dislikes pick-up) but I love mom and DCB. On the other hand I definitely don't want this family to pull their kid because who really wants to get termed for provider misconduct. Happened once and I do everything in my power to prevent it from happening again. So WWYD?

FYI- I never, ever pit two parents against each other, so talking to mom about dad, even if I was termed would never happen here. They're together for life, I'm here for a while. Also dad isn't the type you can gently explain things to, or talk to, he really doesn't listen past 'Hi DCD', seems to zone out like I'm not worth his time. So the 'this is normal pick-up behaviour' speech didn't fly once, not doing it again.

Also, because I'm blue, please tell me some of the usual reasons you've been termed, and for bonus points some outlandish reasons you've been termed, and for double points some on the spot, not overly professional, I just now grew a back bone terms you've done. PS I love details

Thanks for listening ladies

My biggest advice would be to call a conference with both of them. Say how DCD's comments makes you feel that they don't trust the care your are giving their son, ask if there are any concerns they would like to talk to you about. Tell them you only feel comfortable continuing the relationship if they trust you, otherwise they need to find care they can trust.

This will either stop the behavior or they will leave. I would bet that the behavior will just stop. If they really didn't trust your care, he probably wouldn't be in your care. Sometimes these comments come from jealously, or frustration at something else - and they get taken out on you. Bringing it to their attention, will hopefully help.

Oh lord. I've had some doozies, as far as why parents have left. One DCM said her 4yo said that we told him "playing with Barbies is gay if you are a boy" - NEVER in my life have I thought let alone said it. DCB had a 13 yo sister, so I am guessing that's where it came from.

DCM gave notice, because we told her that we couldn't have her child peeing all over the house while in underwear.

DCM left because we wouldn't bring her child to the bathroom every hour, on the hour.

DCM left because we wouldn't spank her child when she had an accident.

DCM gave notice because we kept correcting her child's behavior in her presence, when he broke rules. We were picking on him, according to DCM.

People can be downright crazy when you are dealing with their kids. A lot of emotions come into play, and I think a lot of it is based off of the loss of control they feel when placing their children in your care. There is a lot of jealousy from moms, and the feeling that they could be doing things better than you. Also, they want their children to be happy, but at the same time it is hurtful when their child can be so happy while someone else is caring for them. So many emotions, often contradicting, occur when dealing with parents and their children, and I have learned that I can never please everyone. I do my job the way I do it, the way I know makes me and the children the happiest, and if you don't like it there is the door (with a 2 week notice of course).

*** I just realized that 3 of those reasons had to do with potty-training. Which actually doesn't surprise me. Over 10 years, we have had some crazy potty-training requests. Hence, our iron-clad potty training policy.

**MyAngels** · 03-25-2013, 07:52 PM

I agree with ECS on the sit down with the parents. That is the only way to salvage this relationship.

One of the few times I've had a child leave other than aging out or moving was because of a situation exactly like yours. The little girl cried and carried on at pick up acting like she didn't want her dad and he could not take it. It wasn't long after that that I started the routine of winding down activities toward pick up time to avoid these situations if possible.

**nanglgrl** · 03-25-2013, 08:07 PM

I have no advice because dad seems like a child but I do have a unusual/outlandish term story.

A few years ago two little girls ages 3 and 6 started. Their behavior was atrocious but I got it under control and they became very polite, enjoyable little ladies. They were wonderful until mom showed up and then they would grow horns. Whatever they knew they weren't supposed to do they would do since mom was here. On several occasions I had to take the reigns and correct them even though mom was right there because she wasn't doing anything, she would never back me up. They would listen to me but then mom got a jealous/mad attitude. I could tell she didn't like it but I wasn't going to let her kids climb on my furniture, throw toys etc. just because she was there.

One day the 3 year old started throwing a fit at pick up and was yelling that she didn't want to wear her shoes and she wanted to wear her older sisters. Mom gave in and told the older child to remove her shoes and give them to the younger one. This meant the older child would have to go barefoot because her sister's shoes were way to small. It was Spring and it wouldn't have hurt her to go barefoot but that wasn't the point. I just couldn't take it anymore and asked the mom (quietly so the girls couldn't hear) if she knew what she had just done. I then told her that she just showed the 3 year old that's she's the boss even at the expense of her sister. She left and I could tell she was mad.

Hours later I got a text from the mom asking me if I had changed the 3 year old's pull up that day (they had been with me for 12 hours). I text back and said of course and that she had been changed about an hour before pick up. I even checked my garbage to make sure because at first I was like "did I!?" (you know how sometimes things become monotonous and you wonder). Anyway the pull up was right on top and I sent her a picture mail of it. Then I asked if her pull up was really wet because I was confused why she was asking and she responded "no but I know you didn't because she has a pink Disney princess Pullup with hearts on it like the ones we have home and the ones I sent to your house had stars on them". I went over and looked at the one in the garbage and saw it had little swirls on it so I checked the diaper bag and there was some that had hearts, some with stars and some with swirls. I informed her of that fact and she blew up so I told her they couldn't come back. She then proceeded to call/text me until past 2 am. She wanted to come get their things (the free diaper bag from the hospital, a stained t-shirt and maybe 6 pull ups) I told her she couldn't come right then (I was in bed) and that she could come after closing the next day. I didn't want her to come when my hubby wasn't home because at this point she was just acting insane. Then she said she would be there in the afternoon and if I didn't give her their things she would call the police. It was insane. Anyway, she did get her things, the police weren't called and no punches were thrown but to this day I wonder if this lady was off her meds or what.

**Play Care** · 03-26-2013, 03:26 AM

Originally posted by MyAngels View Post

I agree with ECS on the sit down with the parents. That is the only way to salvage this relationship.

One of the few times I've had a child leave other than aging out or moving was because of a situation exactly like yours. The little girl cried and carried on at pick up acting like she didn't want her dad and he could not take it. It wasn't long after that that I started the routine of winding down activities toward pick up time to avoid these situations if possible.

I do the same thing! I got so tired of kids acting up/not listening etc. and parents seemingly unable to deal with it that I started having the kids clean up a little after 4:00 and then we either do table activities or something similar as parents start coming. I also instituted a rule that no kids are allowed in the foyer unless they are leaving, and used Nannyde's visual barrier on the floor to reinforce it. The kids can go to where the kitchen meets the start of the foyer and wave good bye from there. What a difference!

**rmc20021** · 03-26-2013, 05:24 AM

No words of advice here either...I'd probably have a hard time holding my tongue if I had a dcd like that. Although I'm pretty passive, I wouldn't be able to contain my emotions in a situation like that.

My most bizarre family was a family of 4 dck's who lived in the home with their mom, her husband AND her boyfriend. Some of the kids belonged to one man, some of the kids belonged to the other man.

These poor kids did not have proper winter clothing...no hats, gloves or boots, shoes that were in very bad condition, and between the three adults, they had one car. So it was NOT unusual for me to transport the kids home in order to get them out of my daycare at a reasonable time.

One of the dad's actually threatened to turn me in because I wasn't 'open' when he felt I should be open in order to accomodate them. Never mind all the other things I did to help them out, as well as provided their kids with hats and gloves in order to be warm on their walk to school.

**countrymom** · 03-26-2013, 06:06 AM

I wouldn't do conference just because I would feel like its them against me. I would ask the mom if the dad is happy with the care and just let her know what is going on. Maybe mom has no idea what is going on, and mom can talk to him. Your not going to pit one against the other, sometimes one wears the pants in the family. Also, if you know what time pick up is, then I would get the kid ready sitting by the door and keep the conversation short and sweet and shoo them out, the longer you let dad stay in your house the more time he has to nit pick.

**Blackcat31** · 03-26-2013, 06:18 AM

I don't play those passive aggressive type games.

The minute DCD said "Do you even watch DCB,?" I would have stopped everything I was doing at that moment and called him out for it.

I would have addressed that comment then and there and made sure that before DCD left, he knew FULL well there are NO issues with my supervision.

My biggest pet peeve is people (ADULT people) who can't, won't or don't simply express their needs/concerns with out dancing round the Mulberry Bush.....

I have better things to do with my time than to play that kind of game with a grown man.

I would have had a talk with him right then and there.

I agree with ECS when she suggested a conference with BOTH parents about this. BOTH parents need to know what is going on and BOTH parents need to be on the same page.

BOTH for your sake and for their child's.

PS.....glad you finally joined the forum

That was a VERY rude comment to make and certainly one I think would offend most providers.

**trippingontoys** · 03-26-2013, 06:31 AM

As soon as you figure out what to do, let me know cause I have the same issue with a mom. She once called me after hours to ask me repeatedly if I put someone else's underpants on her child. I used the ones they sent in his bag.

I will give you my only term story so far. The first little girl I watched was a holy terror. So I was not upset when they pulled her. Over the weekend I had a wicked bad toothache. Little girl came on Monday I told her mother I had an appointment first thing the next day for an extraction. (She didn't drop off til 11am) I told her if I was able I would keep her but I had no way of knowing when I would be done. I could call her after I was finished, but she should find a backup in case I wasn't able. She told me she would call me that evening (after she had her phone replaced because she dropped it in the toilet at a party over the weekend) and let me know if she wanted me to call her when I was done. Never heard a thing from her until the next morning at 11am when she sent me an angry text wanting to know where I was, she was at my house. I told her I was still at the dentist and wouldn't be able to keep the girl that day. After a series of angry texts from her she sent one that said the girl would no longer be back due to me being unprofessional and not giving her any notice that I would be closed. I remember the 24 hours notice I gave her for an emergency, but I guess she didn't. I could have made the appointment first thing Monday morning, but I suffered with the toothache for an extra day so I didn't bail on her with only a few hours notice. I have since learned I will never be able to make those people happy that believe the world revolves around them so I stopped trying. I do the best I know how and people are knocking down my door for care so I must not be too bad of a provider. :-)

**Willow** · 03-26-2013, 06:38 AM

Dad is not overly sensitive or "sad."

Dad is just a jerk. Period.

Please don't use feelings he isn't experiencing to justify putting up with his behaviors. He's treating you like garbage. Don't go to mom with it, simply stand your ground and call him out. Tell him it's bothering you and it's unacceptable. A good go to phrase would be "hmmm, I don't understand what you mean, can you tell me more about that?"

Kids don't (or rather shouldn't) love to see the upset in their parents faces. If that's what I thought a child was doing at transition I'd put the kabosh to it immediately.

The only time I've ever had a parent decide to leave on their own accord was when I moved into a house on a water channel. House was a good quarter/half mile from the shore but he insisted that not only would his 5 year old very intelligent child run and throw herself in and drown immediately due to my inability to properly supervise apparently, but there was an electrical line that ran from the larger power poles up by the road to the house and he swore she could easily get a ladder, climb up the 15ft to it and electrocute herself. He followed it up with "your basement is half buried, why would you rent somewhere that can give you radon poisoning..." Knowing he was serious because of his past ridiculousness I laughed (way harder than I needed to for emphasis) and then wished him well finding alternate care.

I heard later from some of my other parents that he had enrolled his child in the same ECFE classes they were taking. When a parent discussion topic of what are you doing now to prepare your child for elementary school, tween and teen years he openly expressed his desire to start bringing her to bars to "start teaching her how to fend off men."

He nearly got into a fist fight with one of my other dcds because of all the insane things he brought to the conversations he actually had the balls to tell one of my mom's who was sharing at group how she recently lost a bunch of weight - "it's about time." Dad was sitting right there and didn't hesitate to drag him outside....

I told him he should have taken a few swings for me while he was there, I'd have been more than happy to comp him a weeks free care :

:

**NeedaVaca** · 03-26-2013, 07:43 AM

Nice screen name

**Sugar Magnolia** · 03-26-2013, 10:24 AM

That dad is a hump! No real advice....

**Unregistered** · 03-26-2013, 05:27 PM

There is always one rotten apple in the bottom of the barrel isn't there? LOL! I've had parents like that here too BUT there have been times when I KNOW that THEY did things at home that would horrify any childcare provider because of their stupidity!

Willow: I love the story about the "genius" child who's father thought she could do all those dangerous things no matter how ludicrous the whole scenario would be...I also had a prospective client here who expressed grave concerns over the railroad tracks that run behind my house...a good 1 /2 mile away...where you would have to go through a very densely wooded area...and it would take a very fit adult to clamber through those overgrown woods...she was certain that her very talented 3 year old would find his way to the tracks , get hit by a train and killed...because of course, I wouldn't have the sense to watch him I'm sure and he would surely elude me being so smart and all...LOL!

Needless to say I wished her good luck on finding someone and hung up..

**AmyKidsCo** · 03-26-2013, 08:17 PM

I had a DCM leave because (among other things) when she picked up her 3 yr old was always playing and the other children were eating snack, which "obviously" meant I wasn't feeding her child snack.

If she'd asked me, I would have told her that I fed her child snack FIRST to make sure he had time to eat before she came to get him. Oy, parents!

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